The ongoing battle against suction


I was just wondering if anyone cant give me some advice, I am trying to print helmets and am struggling Vs. the suction.

At the moment, I am going for approx 30% coverage of supports across the entire surface area which is pretty insane but does work.

I am wondering if anyone has experimented more with leaving area’s unsupported and ‘anchoring’ the print around the outside? I have only failed using this technique but would love to make it work as it saves on time and material.

I am also wondering what ambient temperature I should be going for? I have it set to 30 at the moment but could go hotter.

How much does ‘exposure time’ affect the model sticking to the supports Vs. to the FEP?


Don’t know how your model is? The exposure time is related to the resin and printing equipment you use, and the ambient temperature is around 25 degrees. You can join the FB forum, there are many users who are experienced in printing helmet models. They will give you powerful advice.

I would rather post on here than on Facebook as I don’t want to broadcast everything to all of my ‘friends’, forums are also more searchable and accessible to people who don’t use Facebook.

I am mainly wondering if a higher exposure time helps things stick to the model or stick to the FEP (within the range of the resin)? Let’s pretend I am using Peopoly deft 8s vs 12s exposure. I am also wondering to what extent ambient temperature affects this.

I basically want to know how sparse someone has managed to place their supports whilst still achieving a print with a significant surface area without supports breaking producing layer lines.

Appropriate long exposure of the bottom layer can increase the adhesion. The higher the temperature of the printing environment, the lower the viscosity of the resin, and the exposure time can be appropriately reduced.

I don’t have a problem with bed adhesion, just a problem with the print being sucked off of the supports which I can overcome with an insane amount of supports but would rather get support settings dialed in as high support volume costs dearly and also contributes to suction.

What is the recommended running temp of the Phenom L? I am seeing different suggestions in different places. I was thinking that the heater for the Moai would be a good guideline but 35 deg seems a little bit too hot. If I run at a consistent temperature of 35, would that have adverse affects?

If anybody wants to run a crazy coverage of supports by the way, in Chitubox, wack the auto support angle up to 90 deg and run a density of about 20%, that should give you quick, easy coverage which should not fail as long as you manually add a few extra to the first printing points.

It is recommended that the indoor printing temperature be 25-30 degrees Celsius. Too high temperature is not conducive to heat dissipation and will cause greater damage to the LCD screen. Regarding support, it is recommended to choose heavy support, and the default support setting for other support settings.

Check out these youtube videos.
One is 3d printing pro explaining his chitubox supports which I have yet to try but looks interesting/hopeful
the other is a guy reviewing/printing full massive helmets on the the Phenom L and interviewed by Norm at Tested

Maybe contact them for help/advice

hope this helps!!

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Here is the you tube for the full helmet guy

If he cant help you then I dont know who can

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For FEP film I have just had some success coating the film with a very thin layer of 3-in-One PTFE lubricant (also RainX), then letting it dry. As to PDMS, I am going to experiment with that also, but haven’t tried it yet.

Hello, thank you for the replies, they are somewhat helpful.

I am using ‘Novus Plastic Polish’ 1 & 2 to clean my FEP to theoretically reduce stickiness. Hard to say if it’s doing anything at all because I created a thermal enclosure and upped my bottom layer exposure at the same time.

One of the main problems I am having with 3d printing in general is that testing permutations of solutions is just so time consuming and costly, you are better off nailing down everything that could be the problem and praying for success.

Anyway, what I am actually looking for and what would be incredibly informative to the entire community is essentially large test files which are proven to work in ideal conditions. The suction on the Phenom L is nuts and I can only imagine the amount of time and money wasted by each owner in trial and error.

Resorting to ‘just support the shit out of it’ mentality leaves a lot of unknowns whilst experimenting is simply time consuming and expensive. You want to know but you don’t want to go through the process of finding out.

Getting the machine to operate within a benchmark for large scale prints and having an approach to support structures which I can replicate on my own prints would really be valuable.

I am taking from the silence that this large form factor printer manufacturer does not in fact have any large form prints to benchmark/test with?

What we do have is a bunch of hollow little cubes, overexposed (12 secs not 8 recommended with deft resin) with no suction problems at all by design. Good test for the panel at least.

One of your Facebook contributes stated that we are the beta testers, got to say that that does seem to be the case.

Can’t you just give us the file that you gave to Uncle Jessy?

To NickP,

Thank you for your reply.

I did actually buy some of artisans guilds pre-supported models so I could check out 3d printing pro’s support settings first hand.

I have so far not had a successful print of his figures due to the suction pulling the models partially or completely off of his supports. I am going to try again and again but I need to be in the mood for cleaning my vat to try.

It would be amazing if I could just use other peoples support settings as to not have to do it myself and also not damage my models with large supports.

My conclusion so far is basically, buy a small printer to print small things.

I will update this thread if I do find a print setting combination that works with his stuff, I am planning on having another go in a few days.

If you check out his video (latest video) on printing model bases directly on the plate, that should work fine for just the base.

The dream of printing a lot of little high detail things is simply not a reality on the Phenom L, at least not if you want to minimize damage like 3d printing pro does.