Moai 200 - Problem peeling forces

#1

In order to reduce the Abschälkräfte I’m given to the limits of the settings. Temperature increased to 36 ° C PM speed reduced to 2, nothing helped.

After a closer look at the FEP tub, I realized why this is so. The FEP film can not peel off, but literally breaks off in one shot as it sticks rigidly to the glass sheet.

See and hear in the video:

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Frustrated with Moai 200
Frustrated with Moai 200
#2

after the print is done, can you take closer pictures of the FEP vat? especially the FEP sheet
the glass panel have air holes on the sides so it’s quite hard to imagine the problem you are having

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#3

Thanks for the quick response @peopolysupport. My glass plate has no air holes. The circumferential phase is polished smooth. The FEP film is absolutely flat on the glass surface. Even if there were holes on the edge, the FEP film sticks firmly on the glass surface due to adhesion forces.

The problem has long been known and well described here: SLA 3D-Drucker „Drumhead“ FEP Flexvat:


Are there different variants of the glass and FEP film on the Moai 200?

@peopolysupport, could you please upload a picture of the holes?

Has anyone printed large objects with the Moai 200 and the FEP film on glass without problems? If yes how?

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#4

I see you have one of the first fep plate glass (it does not have vent holes, not for airing the fep film but to help get the bubbles out. we have since developed an advanced version with PDMS as tensioner and an extra film to help with release

for your current plate, you can get better print results with updated settings on the moai 200 guide:
http://wiki.peopoly.net/doku.php?id=moai200:start

make sure you use Asura 2.2.2 the new support with individual base is further enhanced to combat peel force and the paramters in the software is also optimized

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#5

Thanks @peopoly for the answer. Could you please show the scheme and pictures of the advanced version with PDMS as a tensioner and an additional film?

I would like to test the PDMS variant and compare it with the existing system.

I do not consider the current Varinate FEP film on glass plate expedient.

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#6

its basically a 3mm layer of PDMS over the vented acrylic glass, the thinking is PDMS has less stickness then the glass.

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#7

here is what it looks like on the side:

image

it has a pdms layer and another film on top of it (do not remove).

We are also shipping with glass-plate with just the new film on side that will tension the FEP film.

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#8

Thanks Mark for the picture and the info !

The following questions are important to me to understand:

Variant 1:

It has a pdms layer and another movie about it (not remove it).

  1. Is the other film the support for the PDMS layer or on the resin side?
  2. What’s that for another film?
  3. Has the acrylic glass carrier been omitted?
  4. What are the dimensions?

Variant 2:

We are also shipping with glass-plate with just the new film on side that will tension the FEP film.

  1. Is the structure following: Glass + PDMS + FEP + Resin?

  2. What are the dimensions?

  3. What significant differences do you have to the original structure: Glas + FEP + Resin in terms of peel forces achieved with the new variants 1 and 2?

  4. Which resin has the strongest adhesion forces that you have tested so far?

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#9

variant 1 is Glass + PDMS + adhesive film stick on PDMS + FEP + Resin
variant 2 is Glass + PDMS + adhesive film + FEP + Resin

the film is processed Fep so it sticks well on one side

dimensions are all the same as the original. it fits right in.

the PDMS can be thought of as training wheels, it makes leveling easier and is more tolerant of raft/support mistakes. Peel force is about the same for both plates. You could use lower laser power on both of these so that also reduce peel force itself

generally the softer the resin, the stronger the peel. Stick with Peopoly NEX resins for now as it is designed to have a maximum hardness and is ideal for large prinst.

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